Yesterday's Weapons Forums

Thanks warsteel.
That's what I've heard too.
The Britts painted that on the stocks so they couldn't mix them up with the .303 P14s.
Any idea if I can find info on these P14s/P17s on the internet.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

martin , i dont want to seem patronizing so please forgive if i seem so , the original WINCHESTER_REMINGTON_EDDYSTONE contracts were for the british P[patern]1914 , the US retooled to the 3006 in the form of the M[model]1917 , same rifle-diferent cartrige , all this in WWI ,

the US in WWII provided the rifles we had in reserve to our allies , the british and canadians marked these rifles to keep their troops from confusing them with their own 303s , those sent to the pacific[philipines] were not , they are the same rifle made by the same manufacturers yet there are both those of 303 - P1914s , and those of 3006 - M1917s , each legit in their own right and not a revision of existing rifle for any use,

there is a fine book from straton on the P1914 that also adresses the M1917 , and there is a great book by ferris that covers the M1917 , neither are very expensive and both belong in the library of the owner of one of these fine rifles ,

again forgive me if i missread your question and answered incorectly

What A Square10 is saying, and I will put it in differnt terms since English is not your first language is that the companies first started making the P14 rifles for the British in .303 caliber. Several years later this production stopped and the tooling was changed and the rifle was then made in 30:06 and was called the M1917. Rifles were not altered from one caliber into another. They were made at different times. They look almost similar. The P14 will always be a little older than the M1917. Since we had given all the .303 rifles out, and later more were wanted; they had to take the M1917 and they were marked usually in red clearly by the British so a soldier would see he had a 30:06. Thus M1917 rifles with a red band is a sure indication it was given to the British to use. See these sites..

Michael, it's not patronizing at all.
I ask a question on a subject I don't know anything about and you are so kind to give me an answer.
It's the way things work.
Thank you very much for that.

Mick, thanks for your replies and the links.

If I understand the both of you correctly, the P14 and the Model 17 were made in two different periods.
None of the P14's were rebarreled.

Then why does this Model 17 has a piece milled out of the top of the receiver??
From what I've heard it was to accommodate the 30-06 cartridge.

I should have taken pictures while we were at the gunshop.
The rifle will be in Holland in a couple of weeks.
I'll take and post pictures then.
Thanks for taking the time to answer my question.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

Try to get the serial number and maybe we can determine something about it. Where exactly on the receiver has it been altered. The only area that I can conceive of being milled out would be the clip slot. I don't have a M1917 anymore so I can't tell. If anything, I would think that the clip slot for the .303 would be way bigger than any clip slot for the thin 30:06 stripper clip. Is the milling in a different area?

Also,the Model 1917 being in 30-06,the magazine being designed for the .303 rimmed round,will hold 6 rounds as opposed to the P14 only holding 5.No stripper clips however were ever made to hold 6 rounds.

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Guns kill people like spoons make Rosie O'Donnell fat.

mikmarjon, I don't know what you mean, unless you are talking about some metal being removed from the receiver bridge.If the round is too long and hits the rear bridge, then maybe that's what you meant.
The .303 is a wider round, would take a wider clip...( I know they are completely different styles).
Being wider in .303 there would be no reason to mill out the slot for 30:06.

I don't have the rifles to compare to see if the receiver is dimensionally different.

i think what he has seen is one of the rifles that had a cut in the top of the reciever [sort of a half round cut] it has not been determined who did this[in my research] or why , it does appear to be for clearance of the bullet but i 'think' this was done in foreign service after both the US & the BRITS were no longer using them , i once saw a post that sugested for sporter rounds

martin , note the P1914s were marked - ERA for eddystone , RE in an oval for remington , and "W" for winchester [over] serial number , they were made from 1916-1917

the M1917s are marked US [over] MODEL OF 1917 [over] EDDYSTONE , WINCHESTER , REMINGTON , [over] serial number , they were made from 1917-1918

the P14 bolts were numbered to the recievers the M17s were not ,

they both take the same bayonet - made by the same two companies[winchester and remington] but marked P1913 for the british contracts and M1917 [or canceled brit P13 - remarked M17] for the US contracts , the US scabords resemble the british P07 type but had US belt hangers - there were two of those - first had a leather back plate the second had a mount crimped into the throat , you will find danish scabords with a plate added[doubled up] on top of the throat with the crimped on hanger , there was a WWII plastic scabord - resembles the M3 with M1917 marking , and a viet nam era scabord that matches it with slightly diferent marking ,

sorry if i gave an info overload - i love these rifles

Michael,

Thanks very much for your info on these rifles.
It's no overload at all.
I love to read about things I know little about.
Pictures will be posted ASAP.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

im looking forward to seeing them , as i said - i love these rifles

He received the rifle yesterday by mail.
Got some pictures.
No overall picture, just some details.

Let me know what you think.









I´ll call him tomorrow to send me some overall pictures.
For now this is all I have.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

Hi Martin
I was a Canadian issue at the start of the War 1939 1940 has been around.
Cheers

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Gerry

....I dont know about the rest- but the stock marking looks like a Canadian "C"/arrowhead for Longbranch...?????....or am I thinking of something else...???

_________________
....Naj puška govori!....
.............deplorable typical "bitter clinger"....

Doesn't make sense that the receiver would be notched if it was still chambered in 30-06. The 1917 was made for this round. Is it possiblethat it has been rechambered for a longer round?

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It's 5 o'clock and it's watermelon time.....................
because you can't drink beer & load rockets - TXPete

Since it started out as a 30:06, it would not need the clearance cut for standard ammo. It went into British hands, and that would explain the red 30:06 flag. As ET says, the only reason for that clearance cut would be for the use of longer bullets. It is possible they (who-ever) was experimenting with longer bullets and seating them out further. It was probably done on an individual basis and not armory done or approved. As a square says we don't know when it was done. My virdict it is an oddball, done by someone playing with long bullets and seating them out farther.

Hi Guy's
C Broad arrow is a Canadian Govt mark All stores in the military has the C Broad Arrow "Cdn Govt Property" It is not only Long Branch.
Cheers

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Gerry

.......dang...!!!!....we both posted at the same time-but yours must've been seconds before mine... ........and as I said-all I knew was C and the arrow-which reminded me of longbranch.....only thing I could associate it with,so I was close...???...

_________________
....Naj puška govori!....
.............deplorable typical "bitter clinger"....