Yesterday's Weapons Forums

Started reloading for my Dutch Steyr Mannlicher M95 rifle again.
I usually use .303 British Boxer cases and reform them to 6.5x53.5R.
This time however I decided to try the Dutch .303 British cases.
These were manufactured by AI (Artillerie Inrichtingen) in 1959.
The quality of the brass is great.
Problem is that these are Berdan cases and don’t use the 5.5mm (0.220”) Berdan primer, but the larger 6.34mm (0.250”)Berdan primer.


Uncleaned Berdan primer pockets of the Dutch .303Br brass

Not only the 6.34mm, but also the slightly larger 6.45mm (0.254”) Berdan primer fit in this primer pocket.
You not only have to check the diameter, but the height of the primer is important too.
Both Berdan primers have a different height, but both fit the primer pocket of the Dutch AI case.
I already reformed the cases and trimmed them back to 53.45mm (2.104”).
The Dutch AI cases didn’t fit the chamber so I had to adapt the diameter just above the rim by 0.06mm.


6.45mm Berdan.


6.34mm Berdan.
The guy who sold these to me used the primers for his Lee Enfield.

After that it’s priming the cases.
Because of the size of the primers I have to use an adapted shell holder and an handmade primer device .
Riceone made these for me a couple of years ago for which I’m still grateful.


Adapted shell holder and handmade primer device made by Riceone


Left: Dutch .303Br parent case.
Right: Reformed to 6.5x53.5R Dutch (notice the adjusted diameter above the rim)


Time to prime the cases.

From here it’s just business as usual.
Fill up the case, place the bullet and off to the range.


Ready to go to the range.

Here’s the loading data:
Brass: Dutch Berdan .303British reformed to 6.5x53.5R
Primer: 6.34mm and 6.45mm Berdan primers by Dynamit Nobel
Powder: 13.8 grains of VihtaVuori N110 (reduced load)
Bullet: 160 grains cast bullet in cal .266

Got some range time coming up tomorrow.
I’ll keep you all posted.
Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

Well, I'm back from the range and I must say that I'm really happy with the result.
Fire Forming went well and even the target looks better than I expected.

Take a look at this picture.
From left to right you see a Dutch .303 case, a .303 reformed to 6.5x53.5R and a fire formed 6.5x53.5R.
Check the shoulder of the fire formed case.
It fits the chamber of my Dutch Steyr Mannlicher perfectly now.



Here's today's target.
My goal for today was fire forming the cases, but IMHO this target doesn't look bad at all.
First shot was way too low(not on target), second one still too low, third shot was too high but the rest looks OK to me.
I have to adjust the front sight a bit, but the ammo performs great.



Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

thats kool martin and great pics as always.

finding berdan primers over here is hard.I haven't seen any in years.

pete

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Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming - WOW - What a Ride

Thanks Pete.
I appreciate your reply.
As for the Berdan primers....same problem here.
You can find the 5.50mm Berdan primers if you look real well and ask around a lot, but the 6.34 and the 6.45mm primers are real hard to find.
Dynamit Nobel stopped production several years ago.
I found the 6.45mm primers in a dusty corner of a Dutch gun shop only a few miles from my home.
The 6.34mm primers were a gift from a gun club member who had no use for them anymore.
I searched many months for these primers (literally all over the world) and found both just around the corner.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

Nice job Martin! on the pic of the 3 cases side X side..... the middle one looks to have a split neck. Or is just a trick of the camera lens?

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It's 5 o'clock and it's watermelon time.....................
because you can't drink beer & load rockets - TXPete

Thanks Bruce.
You are right, it looks like a split neck, but it must be a trick of the camera lens.
I checked the cases again just to be sure, but found no split necks.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

...I get depressed when I think of how many good berdan cases I've pitched over the years because there was no way for them to be reloaded by someone here...

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....Naj puška govori!....
.............deplorable typical "bitter clinger"....

well thats not really true.rcbs makes a de capper and the old western scrounger had primers about 10 years ago.but it was a PITA to do.

Berdan primers are named after their American inventor, Hiram Berdan of New York who invented his first variation of the Berdan primer and patented it on March 20, 1866.

Edward M. Boxer, of the Royal Arsenal, Woolwich, England was working on a similar primer cap design for cartridges, patenting it in England on October 13, 1866

talk about a flip-flop

_________________
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming - WOW - What a Ride

....by here-I meant local-in "our neck of the woods" ....I knew it could be done but would be a real pain in the obama

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....Naj puška govori!....
.............deplorable typical "bitter clinger"....

well "IF" your neck of the woods has a post office and "IF" you had a phone 10 years ago it would have been easy to get the tools and primers.now if you live in OHIO all bets are off

now if you had the internet
http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/pro ... ctId/13027

and seems like tula is making/importing berdan primers now

http://tulammousa.com/products/non-corr ... n-primers/

so GET busy

_________________
Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming - WOW - What a Ride

Hey Pete, if they are both 6mm dia primers, why the different part numbers?

My brother just bought 4000 rounds of SA 7,62 nato & asked if they were reload-able.........Now I can tell him yes & get myself a berdan decapper on his dime

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It's 5 o'clock and it's watermelon time.....................
because you can't drink beer & load rockets - TXPete

Maybe they have a different height.

Met vriendelijke groet,

Martin

I don't know ET.I was thinking maybe small and large rifle primers???.I would ask before I bought any thats forsure.

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Life is not a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming - WOW - What a Ride

I recently scored a Dutch carbine & have been making ammo from 303 Brit. Having done my research, I discovered 6,5 Dutch is essentially rimmed 6,5 Mannlicher.

Meaning you can reload with regular 6,5 Mannlicher dies & the right shell holder. Much cheeper than dedicated dies!

To reduce ruined cases, you should move the shoulder back in steps. Another site recommends a 7-08 FL die but I couldn't find mine so I used 7,35 Carcano dies to set the shoulder back initially. Worked great & I then FL sized with the 6,5 die.

Made 10 rounds of ammo - now to test fire! SW

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Slava Ukraini!!

I have read various reasons for the British switching from Boxer primers to Berdan, but this was a real win win win for American reloaders when they switched to Boxer primers here if Berdans were really ever used much here.

It was also a great thing that the U.S. miiltary switched (again if they ever did) It has made lots of once fired brass available to the poor common man. This was when brass was cheap. I can think that brass is becoming so expensive it will have to be passed from one generation to the next. I can see it now. "And I leave my 2000 pieces of Lake City 5.56 brass to my grandson Jeff for his own use on condition that he pass it on to his own offspring or nearest surviving relative if he has none of his own." Keep it in the family".

whoa - a 2011 thread that has come back , it moved me to see petes posts and starteled me when i saw who brought it back - i expected it to be a newby hogger .......

Well, I am a n00b to that caliber! SW

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Slava Ukraini!!

OK , i get it , youll like it , reloads well too

Further observations forming 6,5 Dutch from Hornady 303 Brit brass...

303 cases won't work well in Dutch clips unless rim diameter is reduced to .525"

I chucked cases in my cheep truckload sale drill press & applied a mill bastage file to the rim. Cut-n-try until the right diameter was achieved.

Cases wouldn't chamber after FL sizing in a 6,5 Mannlicher die, so I used my 6,5 Carcano FL die to carefully set the shoulder back a few thousandths. I went slowly until the case would just chamber.

Next step will be to fire form... which will happen when the roads dry out. Typical for Memorial day weekend, it has been raining right along here. SW

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Slava Ukraini!!